Dune Reboot

Jackwraith wrote: They wouldn't even have to do the whole Sprawl trilogy. They could just do a nice rendition of Neuromancer, which is already far-reaching enough, conceptually. Gibson's work would be pretty easily transmissible to small or big screen and could even be done well unlike, say, Johnny Mnemonic. One of the reasons I really enjoyed Nolan's Inception was that it reminded me of nothing so much as New Rose Hotel, from the Burning Chrome collection (Yes, I know a film version was made with Christopher Walken. It was awful.) Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser would be very cool. Leiber's stuff might be kind of difficult to get right, but the two leads carried the stories so well that, if the casting were done properly, I think the rest of the stuff (Ankhmar, gods on earth, etc.) could work. Along that same vein, what I'd really like to see is an Elric TV series.

I sometime worry that Gibson, like Lovecraft, is one of those writers that just doesn't translate well to the big screen. And yet, when I read his stories, they seem like they would easily work as movies. Well, except maybe his short stories are too short. Johnny Mnemonic was a great story, but got padded out with all kinds of rubbish to become a feature-length movie, just like what happened to make The Hobbit into a trilogy. I was surprised at the very existence of a New Rose Hotel movie when I stumbled across it in 2003, because not much happens in the very short story which is really little more than a tone poem. Again, New Rose Hotel got padded out to become a movie, though I think it was a mere 75 minutes long. It actually came reasonably close to the original story, and the padding came from excessive and repetitive flashbacks made bearable by the exotic beauty of Asia Argento. I also liked the music, though I was probably the only one.

Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser might be better as a tv show. Many of their adventures could be resolved in a single episode, and the longer stories as multi-episode or season-long story arcs. The closest we've gotten so far proves the potential: The Adventures of Hercules (and his friend Iolaus)

For similar story reasons, tv would be the preferable format for an Elric show. However, Elric really deserves a big budget. Baroque Melnibonean sets, gods, monsters, armies of chaos, and the actual end of the world. And then there is the casting problem. While makeup and red contacts would avoid the necessity of hiring an actual albino, it would take a special actor to look as physically frail as Elric and yet not seem like a joke in the combat scenes. Ideally, such an actor would also be good at delivering intellectual dialogue as well.

drewcula wrote: But I'll offer a counterpoint - I really enjoyed God Emperor. I feel it could have been developed further, but honestly - that book haunts me more than the rest.

I agree strongly and offer another counterpoint: I actually liked the rest of the series. I think books 2&3 were the weakest of all, even with the week ending of chapterhouse.I saw merit is progressing the story as far as it did. Thousands of years as a study on the intergalactic macrocosm, instead of the microscopic.

I think Herbert wanted his readers to think "OK, I get it. Intrigue every where. But tell me how this story progresses because I can fill in the blanks myself." instead of just writing a long series of dramas, filling in every space and holding your hand through it.

I've read all the Anderson and Sons books in hopes of finding my fix. This is where I think there are decent ideas that lacked the execution it deserved. I'm glad I read them, but ultimately, I wouldn't recommend them at all. The butlerian jihad was especially hard. It took me months to finish, such was my disinterest.

oh boy... does this mean a reprint is IN DA HAUS????? OH BOY OH BOY

Shellhead wrote: For similar story reasons, tv would be the preferable format for an Elric show. However, Elric really deserves a big budget. Baroque Melnibonean sets, gods, monsters, armies of chaos, and the actual end of the world. And then there is the casting problem. While makeup and red contacts would avoid the necessity of hiring an actual albino, it would take a special actor to look as physically frail as Elric and yet not seem like a joke in the combat scenes. Ideally, such an actor would also be good at delivering intellectual dialogue as well.

They would have to hire an honest to goodness elf to be convincing.

OK, here is the big problem that constantly surrounds the Dune movie. And it is one nobody really wants to hear.

Despite selling millions of copies, being regarded quite rightly as one of the greatest SF novels of all time (it is my favorite), and despite its overall mainstream literary uptake...it simply is not a mainstream, marquee feature. Period. It is just a little too weird, too psychedelic, too cerebral, and too spiritual to really connect with a post-Star Wars SF audience. This is why Jodorowsky's take, despite departing drastically from the source material, was the best screen version whether it was made or not. Because he was the right kind of filmmaker for it. It is also why (knives out) I think that Lynch's version is so successful on balance- because Lynch wasn't making a mainstream movie. One of the most compelling things about Lynch's Dune is you can almost feel the tension between making a weird, psychedelic, cerebral and spiritual movie and the confining expectations of a big-budget SF blockbuster. It's just too much...but I think Lynch really understood this about Dune, that it is not the next Star Wars (which may be why he signed on with it instead of Revenge of the Jedi).

The HBO series idea is great. Except for then 75% of the air time would have something to do with fucking.

Then there's the miniseries, which did a lot of things right...and shit the bed on some other things.

Some things just aren't meant for billion dollar Hollywood treatments...I would say that Elric, William Gibson and Lovecraft fall into that bucket as well.

Arrival director, meh. The only living filmmakers who I think could do Dune properly would be Luc Besson and...Jodorowsky.

As for the exotic beauty of Asia Argento- I can't disagree because she is a stunning woman, but it is somewhat upsetting that she REALLY looks like her dad!

Legomancer wrote: Why? The Lynch version is perfect.

^^^^

It, literally, could not have been done any better.

Black Barney wrote: oh boy... does this mean a reprint is IN DA HAUS????? OH BOY OH BOY

This game is actually really fun.

You know of it?? It's my favourite friendship-destroying board game i've ever played. It's insanely confrontational. i love it.

It's almost as murder-motivating as Cosmic Encounter

I hope you guys are talking about the original Dune boardgame, not the 1984 tie-in to the Lynch's film.

Barnes, I agree that Luc Besson would be a perfect director. Especially the Fifth Element - Alien 4 Luc Besson (although Valerian might be a big comeback). I disagree on Jodorowsky. My thought throughout the documentary was - we're very fortunate to have Lynch's movie instead. Jodorowsky doesn't get the book, and I think he doesn't get sci-fi/fantasy in general. Dune is not a psychedelic masterpiece. It is fairly complex but well-grounded fantasy (at least, the first 4 books). All the elements of the Dune's world make sense within that world, and there's barely anything gratuitous (again, first 4 books). The story itself is a pretty straightforward. One book critic called it something like "Hamlet but in space, and Hamlet wins," which I totally agree with.

I don't know man, if you've read any of Jodorowsky's comic books, I think he has a pretty darn good handle on SF. The Incal and Metabarons are among the best SF of the past 50 years.

I could not possibly be more excited about Valerian...but it is going to run into an issue where people think it is derivative of other SF...that is derivative of Valerian.

the chick in that is 24 but they make her look so young that I feel super guilty finding her cute

Michael Barnes wrote: I don't know man, if you've read any of Jodorowsky's comic books, I think he has a pretty darn good handle on SF.

I have not, and I admit have not watched any of his movies in their entirety, because weird boredom. So I am only judging by his interview in the documentary. My impression is that he wanted to go weird, extravagant and psychedelic for the sake of weirdness, which - as a big fan of the book - I just can't stand. Dune is not like a shroom trip, and Arrakis is not living planet, and Dali is not Emperor Corrino. It looks to me he would have been better off adapting Philip K. Dick, whose books are in fact psychedelic. I love K. Dick, too, but Herbert is all about solid foundations for his fantasy world, there´s nothing random or shocking for the sake of shocking there.

He keeps confusing Dune with Flash Gordon. Easy mistake to make.

SuperflyTNT wrote: He keeps confusing Dune with Flash Gordon. Easy mistake to make.

'Paul!! ahhh-AHHHHH! He's the leader of the universe!"

'Flying blind on a Fremen ornithopter?"